Choke constriction, together with barrel dimension this can give a brief view of the choke. Caliber 15mm, length 122cm. Can anybody shed some light here? The Lion Rampant over PV was applied to the Optional Supplementary Smokeless proof for shotguns in 1898. Jun 21, 2012. Most specimen marks are of this nature, and it is no unusual thing to find the marks of two different smiths upon the same weapon, one man signing the lock work, the other being the barrel maker. Greetings Easthampton again, I have since, researched:The officers of the 105th Ohio were issued the 38-40 44. All 31 Belgian gun makers, Belgium dealers and sellers and suppliers Home > Companies Gun & arms makers from Belgium country Czech Republic South Africa Israel Malaysia Netherlands Belgium Norway United Arab Emirates Finland Nigeria Ukraine Hungary Indonesia Lithuania Serbia Slovak Republic Croatia New Zealand Sweden Greece Japan Slovenia It passed proof for nitro which at the time would have been a service pressure of about 9,000 psi. Thomas Jefferson. Until 1894, stamped in .02mm graduations, then in 0.1mm steps, Degree of choke, in this case 0.7mm constriction. and BELGIUM had a glut of old, obsolete flint lock and percussion gun parts left over from years past. Courard N. The size of this book of 232 pages 14 Designates guns with rifled chokes. Since 1924 used on all rifled arms. the 20th century. Serial # 58755 S76 This custom made Belgium gun was probably designed for the European market. Comblain Dieudonn Joseph Some proved pieces exist, and are marked in the case of revolvers with the letters U.S., in the case of other arms with the letters V.P. Very little: I'm assuming it isn't a muzzleloader but a breechloader, which means it could be as early as 1860-1865, say. Christophe & Montigny The other side of the coin is that quality can indeed be there in Belgian guns: The Belgian Browning Superposed were all fine guns, whilefirms like Francotte, Dumoulin, or Lebeau-Courallycould make guns of very high quality indeed. I would be grateful to any lover of arms who possesses authentic dated weapons, or has catalogued a private collection, if he would send to me, in care of my publishers, any such information which will add to the mass of fact available. "Cueruy" could be the maker. We provide antique gun prices and pictures of each antique firearm we sell. Bronne Gustave outlawman7 - The reason for a lack of response here may be found in the post immediately above yours. The lack of chamber length probably means it was made before 1892.Is there a name on it? The viewers mark was a capital V, also surmounted with a crown. There are literally thousands of small individual makers, and often such . Firearm Proof Marks, Arsenal & Inspector Marks Original British Martini-Henry Rifle Extractor Mk IV From $34.95 Free Domestic Shipping on orders $300+ Hassle Free 30 Day Return Period 100% Safe Secure Checkout Guaranteed Authentic to the Historical Period A "Greener" double? Ray D, STOGERS, advertised them as being made for the AFRICAN tribes to hunt with because with them they would not be able to rebel against the BELGIAN rulers who had modern arms. Closset Louis - Remy Hubert "Proofs" as they are sometimes referred to have changed over stream The problem is this mark was used from 1818 (muzzle loading period) until 1893, so that hardly narrows down the time frame. Arendt Maurice Cap Joseph Provisional black powder proof for breech loading guns, since 1924 reserved for smooth bore barrels. Do you have any knowlege of pinfire double barrels? Bettonville - Fontaine I can send pictures of it. Consignment Sale Information. M Mecar (4 P) Pages in category "Firearm manufacturers of Belgium" % Bernard Victor & Cie After years of looking at and trying will it take normal 12 gauge shells then? I have pictures If you need them. He received his technical training in Soest and then in Warstein. Needless to say, I bought the gunand it will never be for sale as long as I am alive. Hunting, fishing, cooking, and other critical aspects of life. Your help is appreciated. However, there are more proof marks that I cannot find on the internet. Belgian proofs are among the oldest and have a very long history. << /Length 5 0 R /Filter /FlateDecode >> is about 30 cm X 22 cm (11.80" X 8.60"). The are no available records of these old Belgium shotguns, Because of the action and style the best guess would be an era, between 1920 and 1940. [more like this] Belgian Flobert Style Warnant 8mm Parlor. Black powder proof for rifles and shotguns. Technically the company is owned by Belgium firearms maker FN Herstal. this book online and pay it through Paypal. Volunteer arms co. on October 29, 2020: 16 gauge serial number is 90524xe what would it be worth and how old is it. I suspect the gun is a Janssen. The wood does not look ancient so I am guessing in the 1970s or so. BELGIAN FLOBERT SINGLE SHOT RIFLE: Circa. Made in the USA: A List of where gun makers manufacture It means it's a 12 gauge that has been proofed with black powder. Is there a 70mm stamp on the extractor blade faces? Home | Login | Register. But despite the history the belgian proof stamps are rather straight forward, normally one cant get more information from the proof more than it has been done if one cant find the inspectors mark. Shotguns - Belgium Double for sale - Guns International Drue, yes, the absence of rifling means that this pin-fire was used for shot.Pin-fires represent an important stage in the development of firearms. Sorry for my delay in responding: I've been OOT and off-line for two weeks. Anyone else know? Proof marks are the official stamps or ciphers showing that a barrel has been properly tested with the prescribed excess charges of powder and ball that allow a large factor of safety to the user. What does 12 over C mean in a triangle? By Alain Daubresse. I live in Tennessee and would love help on identifying this gun down to the year and place made. Rifles & Musket Information. Unmarked barrel with Belgian proof mark, action currently . Entries are listed by initial year of service descending, then grouped by designation (A-to-Z) to better showcase a given country's evolution in the field of infantry arms. Hits and Misses: Dating a Double-Barreled Hammer Gun - Blogger Around the 1880s, Damascus barrels became an object of the past. Applied to all gun not made in Belgium but proofed in Belgium. The book Bonzon & Arents & Cie Courard A.H. Fox guns came in 12-gauge, 16-gauge, and 20-gauge. Email: Info@hlebooks.com It was used by a myriad of hunters for all kinds of wild game. Belgium vs. Japan: Who Made the Better Browning Auto-5? Revolvers are marked on barrel, on the frame, and on each chamber. I also looked at other European proof marks but didn't find the one you mention: compare http://www.cornellpubs.com/Catalog/proof-marks-intl.pdf. Belgium Infantry Arms List (Current and Former Types) - Military Factory Belgian Liege gunmakers (D to F) - Volume 2 The text is written in French AND English. CLEMENT, J. So the barrel strength would be just a bit less than "modern" barrels; but not the corrosion resistance of Winchester Nickel Steel or AISI 4140. On barrel action of breech loading shotgun after the gun has passed proof with semi-smokeless powder . since 1929 Eibar admission proof for guns with old marks since 1929 Eibar proof used in . Spain depended for long upon the proof of individual armourers, and most Spanish barrels were marked with the stamp of the maker set in a square or oblong block under a crown. Length of chamber over diameter of chamber. Double gun shotguns - Side by Side shotguns, and over under shotguns - Including drillings, double barreled rifles, SxS double rifles, combination guns. The one on the far right is the definite proof for nitro, or smokeless powder. M855 Green Tip, Didn't find what you were looking for? Long Beach, CA: Safari Press, 2000. Proof It is unfortunate from the point of view of history that weapons were not marked with a date letter as is customary with silver hall-marks, but the proof-marks stamped upon arms give no indication of the period of proof. The IZh motorcycles and automobiles are manufactured by. Withdraw it and lay it along the barrel, lining up the pencil mark with the muzzle. Smaller gauges progressively cost more, with 20-gauge guns generally bringing at least twice the price of a 12 gauge. Burrard, Major Sir Gerald. Can you add any details? Further changes were initiated, when smokeless powder necessitated more stringent conditions of proof. The "1136" might be the serial number for that pair of pistols. Hand Guns 9 Rifles-Shotguns 0 . Too, seems to be an odd, long cut in the standing breech for the Greener Crossbolt. Antique Gun List Antique Guns and Firearms including Antique Hand so that means it is for sure a 12 gauge? If the price seems too good to be true, it probably is. Bertrand Antoine Introduced for handguns in 1894, rifles over 8mm in 1897. Modern pistols and revolvers are proved in their last stage of manufacture when complete with action and in firing order. 29 Classic Guns: Old Rifles, Collectible Shotguns, and - Field & Stream There's no indication of chamber length--but that didn't begin until 1892.The other marks I can't identify.So what can I tell you? Bultot Jean significance or purpose. Belgian Arms cie Firearm Proof Marks, Arsenal & Inspector Marks ('Manufacturer') Home > Product Catalog Shotguns made in Belgium category Firearms/ Small arms 731 Rifles 237 Shotguns 359 Pistols 134 Blank/Signal/Rubberball pistols 1 Black powder/Muzzleloader 2 Ammunition 3 Ammunition Components/Reloading 20 Bernimolin be reproduced, in part or in whole, without the written permission of '. Please - no questions about your old guns. Antique Double Barrel Shotgun: Identifying, Valuing, and Buying If there is no Lion over PV, the gun was NOT proved for smokeless powder. First Obligatory Proof Load for "Double-Barreled Breech-Loading Sporting Guns", Have a us arms Belgium, looking for info, reciever and barrel are stamped with 1563 has the circle elf star, has the Le peron, barrel ha a 33 stamp and an 18.0 stamp also has something that looks like JIT stamped any comments appreciated , trying to figure out when it was made. Ever seen that? Makers - Darne, Merkel, Arrieta, Beretta, Browning, Holland, Purdey, Richards, Bernardelli, Parker, Fox, LC Smith, and most other double barreled shotgun, gun and double rifle makers. To establish this rule, they constructed a proof house near the City of London. Old Belgian musket help | The Muzzleloading Forum Ad Categories: Pre-1840. You can also browse other antique pistols for sale or additional categories as diverse as Colts, Winchesters, and antique long guns. PDF PROOF MARKS ProoF MarKs - NRA Museum Board Of Its weight Outdoor Hub, LLC (d/b/a Carbon Media Group), 30800 Telegraph Rd, Suite 1921, Bingham Farms, MI 48025 USA. Any ideas as to date range? for your continued support, encouragement and admonishment. But despite the history the belgian proof stamps are rather straight forward, normally one can't get more information from the proof more than it has been done if one can't find the inspectors mark. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. Always found in conjunction with the stamps above, which would indicate type of powder. to identify antique arms from different parts of the world, we decided Any maker's name on the rib between the barrels?Best,Gerry, 1902 a greener twobarrel it has hh on botten of barrel what do i have. Any idea how to date it? Misc. If you could find the time to give me a clue what exactly this gun is I would greatly appreciate it.Thanks,John. Breechloaders had existed previously, but Casimir Lefaucheuxs 1835 invention of the pin-fire cartridgea cylinder with a pin extending at right angles to the base which detonated a fulminate charge in the cartridgequickly led to better breechloading systems and to the development first of rimfire and then of centerfire cartridges.Dating pin-fire guns: the 1835 date of Lefaucheuxs invention gives us a convenient terminus a quo: if the pin-fire wasnt invented until 1835, any pin-fire gun cannot be earlier than 1835. Do check with a gunsmith before you shoot it! I'm not familiar with the proof mark you describe, although a French one exists of AR with a three-pronged crown above, used for smokeless powder proof (but no M). The 2 On barrel locking system or chamber if the lumps are part of the barrel after final black powder proof, Preliminary proof for unfinished barrels, and indicated barrels had not been weakened after proof by breeching, Used on muzzle loaders, Bore diameter in millimeters. There's no indication of choke--but that didn't begin in Belgium until 1898. How does it open? HI, John. 1891 - present 16 Barrel weight in grams of nitro proofed shotguns. In contrast to Walther, Mauser did not start over with serial numbers at the . No small part of the Belgians' remarkableability to meet the demands of a wide variety of firms trading all over the world was their willingness to go on producing type of guns that were obsolete. This will be an on going Brancquaert Louis Bernard Alphonse http://sites.google.com/a/damascusknowl m/www/home. Come join the discussion about optics, hunting, gunsmithing, styles, reviews, accessories, classifieds, and more! There's no brand name on it (I've been p and down it 100 times) it does say laminated barrel and that's it. It has a gold trigger and serial number starts with an x. I'm very curious as to why there is an "FN" above the serial #. Very helpfull once again. A reader hasasked me to say something aboutBelgian proof marks. Bovy Thodore Joseph If you are interested in import, export, or wholesale purchase of shotguns, theres no better place than AmmoTerra to find a buyer or supplier of military equipment. Beau, I need help finding out more about this pistol.. leg in a circle star over the k in 3 places and a crown over jj and the name j. Cueruy and NR under the grip. Key Findings. location, rather than a manufacturer. Mark, I'm unclear what the "leg in a circle" looks like; ditto the "star over the k". Classic Arms Importers and manufacturers of blackpowder guns and kits, located in Palmer, Massachusetts. Shotguns became popular after the U.S. Army used them during the First World War while close-range fighting in trenches. Antique Gun List Antique Guns and Firearms including Antique Hand country requiring that weapons sold within the respective country, and Bischop Pierre Get this product now as it would not last, Contract - 5.56 x 45mm 62 Gr. I can't find any other mumbers on the gun other than the multiple proof markings that I will post later. Made in Colton N. Y. probably around the 1860s. Burlet referred to more commonly as "Proof Marks", (Six volumes by alphabetical order), Belgian Liege gunmakers (A to C) - Volume 1. In some cases this cipher is also preceded by the figures 16, and followed by a capital B., also surmounted by a crown. All 24 Shotguns made in Belgium, Belgian made Shotguns from Collings Hadelin The proof marks for Eibar, in Spain, are the letters Po, surmounted by a crown.

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