THANK YOU FOR SUPPORTING VETERAN JOURNALISM - JOIN SOFREP+ Now additional rounds that struck muscle tissue did major tissue destruction and one in the arm shattered the bone and almost severed the arm ending the battle and even that round failed to exit. Grogan and Dove were kneeling alongside the drivers side of their car. This coating is still widely used on many of Winchester's rifle bullets today.[4]. The second hit the drivers side window post and fragmented, with one small piece hitting Platt in the scalp. This ammo has not been manufactured for many years. 24 years ago, Black Talon ammo hit the dealers shelves with a advertising blitz on the part of Winchester. 12 Reasons Why Black Talon Is The BEST Exotic In Season Of The - Reddit The cartridge provided additional ammunition (so to speak) for gun control advocates to rally against civilian gun ownership while other critics focused on the Black Talon name. The larger the wound channel the more likely the threat will drop quicker. This is original .45 ACP Winchester Black Talon 230gr. Officer Heckman does not remember Platt leaving the Grogan/Dove car. Home Ammunition Black Talon and Todays Best Self-Defense Ammo. It was captained by Revinal Orzik. Glock 30 Gold dot 200 gr +P / Critical Duty 220 gr +P / HST 230 gr +P Check out ourDAILY DEALS pagefor industry deals and discounts. Killed after being shot 12 times. [10], Colin Ferguson used Black Talon ammunition for his Ruger P89 919mm pistol during a 1993 shooting incident. Both are offered on the Underwood website which I like to go to. I chose my Rangers because theyre on the FBI approved list, and they were the cheapest. Advanced The black appearance was due to the oxidized copper jacket. At the time, Winchesters Black Talon was one of, if not the most effective hollow point duty round you could buy. Regardless however after that day & event, we in south as Leos began changing from 38 revolvers to semi autos First to 9MM then eventually to 40 call semi with JHP rounds. The fifth hit Matix in the face, penetrated the jaw bone and neck and came to rest by the spinal column. While the Black Talon may have been a PR nightmare for Winchester, it was not a complete loss for the company. Despite being riddled with bullet holes from the FBI agents, Platt was able to continue firing back. On the other hand, using the bullets that the FBI uses becomes a prudent choice and a case that the D.A. [8] Just prior to ramming the Monte Carlo, Manauzzi had pulled out his service revolver and placed it on the seat in anticipation of a shootout,[8] but the force of the collision flung open his door and sent his weapon flying. Black Talon, though innovative and groundbreaking back in the day, is nearly 25 years old. I'm the knife nut that everybody is ashamed to know. Hence, I tend to use Federal HST, Speer Gold Dot, Ranger Talons/PDX1 as EDC rounds I would ask others to try firing the otherwise well-conceived Critical Defense round through 2-4 of lumber to see if the nose also becomes clogged with soft would, preventing expansion entirely. Black Talon was controversial, and Winchester discontinued sales to the general public in 1993 and ceased manufacture in 2000. The Black Talons petals look more like well talons, essentially making the wound channel even wider. In todays offerings, I feel that the most important thing is guaranteed quick expansion, because the FPS on pistols is nowhere near a rifle. The shots were believed to have been fired by Dove. By admin | January 9, 2023 | 32. 4-6 diameter wound cavity about 10 long. By the time I moved back to the States and started shooting again, new stories and legends long surpassed talk of the Black Talon. Yes there are a whole lot of new gun owners since 2019. Winchester Ammunition 230 Grain Jacketed Hollow-Point (JHP) Ammo Details. This page is not available in other languages. Speer Gold Dot is a .45ACP that will give some kind of decent expansion in short barrels, even with 230-grain loads. I generally test new bullets to see how they expand through barriers one is likely to encounter. Any idea on value??? THANK YOU FOR SUPPORTING VETERAN JOURNALISM - JOIN SOFREP+ , PO Box 1077 MURFREESBORO, Tennessee 37133 United States, P.O. The Black Talon and other high-performance ammunition combine a hollow point, which enables the bullet to expand upon impact, and notched configurations, which direct the expansion into a sharp . Buffalo Bore ammunition also loads this solid copper Barnes bullet in some of its calibers. The rifle version did not share the handgun bullet's barbed petal design and was basically a solid copper hollow-point with a hollowed out rear shank containing a lead core in a steel liner to prevent jacket rupture thus maintaining necessary penetration in tough game. Of course, with a normal round, a Teflon-coated bullet has no advantages overa conventional bullet when striking a protective vest. I personally used to use federal hydroshock mainly because thats what was available to me and what I was used to until watching some videos on YouTube about the g2 research rip rounds and the underwood extreme defender rounds.the rip rounds do kinda look impressive but at the same time dont look to me like they would have much of a impact.now the underwood on the other hand Ive seen go through a class 2 vest and still penetrate 16 of ballistic gel leaving a wound cavity thats just massive and that was only a 9mm round.ordered both brands recently and plan on testing them out for myself especially since theyre only 115grain rounds in a 40cal which is what my cc cal is.curious to see if I can get the same results penetrating diff barriers such as drywall,plywood,glass,sheet metal and a vest with a 40cal opposed to the 9mm in video.have a strong feeling that my new carry round will be the underwood extreme defender though.pray i never have to use one in defense but if i do i dont think anything or anyone would still be standing after getting hit with a extreme defender round. [5] The round quickly developed a reputation as a very effective expanding bullet. .357 Mag 180gr Winchester Black Talons | Defensive Carry Best Handguns for Detectives in Fiction | The Writer's Guide to Weapons. The lawsuit, however, was dismissed. Nevertheless, Winchester still buckled to the pressure and in 2000 discontinued the Black Talon, albeit in name only. Suspects[edit] Winchester Black Talon Bullets: Modern-Day Equivalents In 1996 a lawsuit was subsequently filed by one of the victim's family members (McCarthy v. Sturm, Ruger and Co., Inc., 916 F.Supp. Not true. I went to carrying a 40 cal Sig plus a backup and even 2 shotguns in my unit. Black Talon ammo was developed by Winchester and became the target of liberal media scrutiny back in the 1990s. Of his many gunshot wounds, this first was the primary injury responsible for Platts eventual death. Winchester Black Talons The handgun ammo that was just "too good" to *Lighting a path to truth* Former Navy JAG Worldwide U.S. Military Defense. Were either Platt or Matix ex-military? Anything on that list should do the trick. (877) 214-9327 info@collectorsfirearms.com Products by Category Browse the ARCHIVES! Legend has it that some surgeons found the sharp edges of the claws created a job hazard for them when they would probe a wound and tear open their rubber gloves on the sharp points. If you compress the blood vessels in the body enough, the blood ruptures vessels at the weakest point. Black Talon rounds were known for the unique construction of the bullet and its sharp petal shape after expansion following impact with tissue or other wet media. Seriously injured by .223 gunshot wounds to the right hand and groin. Black Talon is a brand of hollow-point pistol and rifle ammunition introduced in 1991 by Winchester, primarily intended for law enforcement and personal defense use. Unfortunately, Winchester stopped producing Black Talon ammunition in 2000, which only fed into its mystique. The Black Talon Story | Springfield Armory Forums 50rds - 45 ACP Winchester Ranger Talon 230gr. +P HP Ammo This is despite their ubiquitous nature and the fact that many police departments and gun owners trust and rely on hollow points for self-defense. If you were wearing a protective vest the best bullet you want to hit by is an expanding bullet so the material in the vest absorbs the energy. Underwood is the only thing that i trust to keep my wife and kids safe when I am not at home. . It just makes one realize when your shift began you never knew what may happen. But now the hysteria is .223 fragmenting into a bunch of tiny pieces. Problem with the short bbl. It's a proper oddity, the Black Talon. In December, Colin Ferguson killed six people and injured 19 more on a train in New York. References In 1993, the Black Talon bullet gained notoriety after it was used by a gunman in a mass shooting in a California law office. Having been in several shootings the defender should expect more than zero penetration on a K5 40 caliber hit. An example is a 9mm 50 grain JHP that has a velocity of 2000 Ft per second! As a result, the FBI began the search for a more capable sidearm and more effective ammunition. This is simply a brilliant piece of work. TheFirearmBlog // Those knowledgeable about guns and ammunition know that a Black Talon isnt any more deadly than other hollow points, just like an AR-15 isnt any more deadly than a Remington Model 700. Of the eight agents at the scene, two had Ithaca Model 37 shotguns in their vehicles (McNeill and Mireles), three were armed with semi-automatic Smith & Wesson Model 459 9mm pistols (Dove, Grogan, and Risner), and the rest were armed with Smith & Wesson revolvers. Agents[edit] Black Talon .357 Mag Cartridges - Long Range Hunting Forum While its black color and petal-like constructiongave it a very distinctive look, the rounds performance was roughly on par with other hollow points. Religious experts also commented that many of the claims that Jihawg made were false and that it is not a transgression if a Muslim isforced to eat or touch pork. [1] Regardless it was a tragic, horrific day in south Florida in particular that day as well as law enforcement in general. Not only does Jihawg guarantee that all of their ammunition meets or exceeds S.A.A.M.I. When a hollow point bullet hits a soft target, it expands to what looks like a flower with petals. Gun #: 975110313 Seller: GunFactory ( FFL) $219.99 Full Details 1 Image (s) Elevation Talon 46 Bow Case Black 46 In. While the suspect was wearing only a T shirt the round penetrated the sternum and failed to enter into the vital organs. Wonderful !!! Mireles drew his .357 Magnum revolver, moved parallel to the street and then directly toward Platt and Matix. John Hall, FBI Firearms Training Unit Director at the time called the tragedy an ammo failure. The aftermath encouraged the FBI to seek new guns, more effective ammunition and set precedence for the FBIs protocol on ammunition evaluation and testing. Due to collision damage, Matix could only open his door partially, and fired one shotgun round at Grogan and Dove, striking their vehicle. Think a little bit harder/smarter. Following the United States Army's selection of the SIG Sauer P320-derived M17 pistol in the Modular Handgun System competition, the Army announced two new 9mm rounds would be adopted alongside the gun, the M1152 Ball, an 115 grain full metal jacket round "for use against enemy personnel, for training, and for force protection", and the M1153 Special Purpose, a 147 grain jacketed hollow point round "for use in situations where limited over-penetration of targets is necessary to reduce collateral damage." When the Black Talon expanded, it resembled talons, essentially creating a massive wound channel. Winchester designed the ammunition with stopping power in mind, but the gun maker soon found itself embroiled in controversy after the round was involved in a Long Islandshooting in 1993. "[19][20] Both the round and the firearm have subsequently been adopted by all branches of the United States Armed Forces, except for the Coast Guard. McNeill fired over the hood of Manauzzis car but was wounded by return fire from Platts Ruger Mini-14 rifle. The gun community is all too familiar with the lies and language of fear from the media and anti-gun politicians. In 2007 Winchester updated their Ranger SXT line and renamed it Ranger T-Series. Even now, people still claim Black Talon was the best defensive round and search for its modern day equivalent. The reverse taper refers to the bullets jacket being thicker at the tip than at the base. The Black Talon exotic sword is still a beast in Destiny 2. This round is an excellent choice for self-defense or home defense. Many in the firearms community noted the latter hollow point round is conspicuously similar to the Ranger T/ Black Talon, in response Winchester largely avoided the question, saying that despite obvious similarities the round was designed to "maximize performance based on the government specification set out in the request for proposal. Wish I could write this well! Black Talon Ballistic Gel Test ** 45 ACP & 10mm ** - YouTube Platt then entered the Grogan/Dove car in an apparent attempt to flee the scene. [10] McNeill returned fire with six shots from his revolver, hitting Matix with two rounds in the head and neck. FACTORY ORIGINAL WINCHESTER * BLACK TALON * AMMUNITION 45ACP 230gr. Expansion in gelatin blocks starts within 1/2-1 of entry and leaves a approx. Ideally both! Yes, 2000 ft per second and they ship the ammunition to your door. This enhances rigidity which allows the sharp "talons" to remain perpendicular to the wound path. boxes. In 2009, Winchester-Olin released a new hollow point bullet in its Supreme Elite line of handgun ammunition called the Bonded PDX1. Hanlon fired at Platt and was shot in the hand while reloading. PDX-1 looks the same on expansion as the BT, except now the claws are filled in with lead because PDX-1 is a bonded bullet, which is a superior design to the non-bonded BT. Gordon McNeill: Smith & Wesson Model 19 .357 Magnum revolver, six rounds .38 Special +P fired. Mireles does not remember this happening. Terminal ballistics testing of hollow point bullets is generally performed in ballistic gelatin, or some other medium intended to simulate tissue and cause a hollow point bullet to expand. Israels Cutting-Edge Missile Warning System to Be Deployed in Ukraine This May, US Special Forces Evacuate Embassy Staff in Sudan: Other Americans Left Behind, Again, Navy SEALs David Goggins versus Dan Crenshaw in SEAL on SEAL Internet Death Match, SOFREP Stands With Our Brothers Who Demand Responsibility for Disastrous Afghan Departure, Adam Brown: A SEALs Life of Courage and Redemption, Complete List: Ticonderoga-class Missile Cruisers To Retire By 2027, Nuclear Close Calls That Nearly Caused World War III, Russian Sausage Millionaire and Putin Critic Falls to His Death in India. Speer Gold Dot and Hornady Critical Duty also offer superb terminal ballistics in all calibers theyre available in. Previously only offered to law enforcement, Speer Gold Dot G2 offers the ultimate performance for self-defense thanks to an exclusive nose design. This is as close to a perfect Comprehensive Readers Digest version, in the 45 words or less format of the complete facts and points of interes as one could ask for! Hornady Critical Duty, with FlexLock technology, delivers "barrier blind" performance when shot through common urban barriers. You can use it in melee, like a normal sword, but you can also shoot void projectiles. Most of the design for the Black Talon was rolled over into the Ranger SXT ammunition, which operates on much the same principle.

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